Bug #19783

RPG gunners are hitting targets over a kilometer away

Added by Jester814 about 4 years ago. Updated almost 4 years ago.

Status:Expired Start date:05/17/2011
Priority:Normal Due date:05/31/2011
Assignee:- % Done:

0%

Category:-
Target version:-
Component:sys_rocket_ballistics Affected Version:
Close Reason:

Description

Recently I have noticed that my vehicles are getting taken out EVERYWHERE I go without fail on the first shots. Then I noticed that these shots were often coming from 500-1000 meters away.

rpg_hit_probabilies.jpg - RPG Hit probabilities (125.2 kB) joedamage, 05/28/2011 21:27

History

Updated by Jester814 about 4 years ago

I forgot to add that these were RPG-7 gunners.

Updated by Sickboy about 4 years ago

  • Status changed from New to Assigned
  • Assignee set to q1184
  • Component set to sys_rocket_ballistics

Updated by q1184 about 4 years ago

A repro mission would help.

Updated by Sickboy about 4 years ago

  • Status changed from Assigned to Feedback

Updated by tolko_download about 4 years ago

I guess there were AI gunners? Did you try to shoot with RPG-7 personaly from 1km at moving targets?

Updated by Cleric2145 about 4 years ago

Just from personal experience, it's pretty damn hard to hit anything past 200m with the RPG it it's moving.

Updated by fireship4 about 4 years ago

For human players and stationary targets i can state that it is entirely possible to hit a target accurately at 700m with some practice and a spare rocket or five.

EDIT with the long range RPG warhead, I forget which.

Updated by tyler2 about 4 years ago

Jester814 wrote:

Recently I have noticed that my vehicles are getting taken out EVERYWHERE I go without fail on the first shots. Then I noticed that these shots were often coming from 500-1000 meters away.

Before writing this, first try to get himself on a moving target from a distance of 700 meters!

Updated by tolko_download about 4 years ago

I think that RPG man was high skilled terrorist :D Realy, it's not easy to hit targets with RPG-7 at 500-1000m, especialy with 7VR. If you get constantly shots with this old RPG system I think you need to get some practice on something like "Training Grounds" in Shack Tacktical or some other squads.

No personal dude) But it's realy funny to hear like "I'm getting shots with Makarov at 1 km EVERYWHERE!!!!" or "N tank killed my supermegabicycle on the move" cry cry cry :P

Updated by Sickboy about 4 years ago

  • Due date set to 05/31/2011

Well it's possible there's a bug involving AI etc, but we'll need a repro mission and steps.
Tomorrow is update day, so preferably yesterday.

Updated by fireship4 about 4 years ago

hehe

Updated by Lazyman about 4 years ago

Well, I remember getting utterly murdered by SPG-9-equipped moving technicals from more than a kilometer away a looong while time ago, but I thought the fact that AIs don't have to compensate for rocket drop was fixed. Maybe that's the problem?

Updated by rocko about 4 years ago

  • Target version set to Planned (Needs Contributors)

Updated by joedamage almost 4 years ago

Not to labour the point, but this has been mentioned several times before Bug #17423 and Bug #16850. Attached to Issue #17423 you'll find several sources of information regarding the accuracy of RPGs.

So just to help, here is some further information:

"The launcher with optical sights weighs 6.9 kilograms (15.9 pounds) and has a maximum, effective range of 300 meters against moving point targets and 500 meters against stationary point targets. 500 meters is also the maximum range of rocket assisted flight, which enables a flatter trajectory and more accurate aiming."
From: http://defense-update.com/products/r/rpg.htm

"However, most RPG-7 operators are dedi-cated to this job and do receive a lot of training. If that is the case, the optical sight gives many advantages. Combined with a modern laser range finder, the optical sight can truly extend the range of the RPG-7 from its “point- blank” designated 300 meters to a full 500 meters, depending on wind conditions."
From: http://www.scribd.com/doc/26118798/The-Small-Arms-Review-vol-10-No-3-raffica-Raffica-Special-the-Rpg-7-December-2006

It looks like it takes a lot of training and perfect conditions to hit targets at 500m.

In Osprey Publishing's book, "The Rocket Propelled Grenade", the effective range for the PG-7M projectile as listed as 150m. That is, the range at which it is effective. Now that doesn't mean that it can't fire out to say, 920m, which is about as far as it gets before the warhead detonates, but it does suggest, that its not very effective at that range. Otherwise it's effective range would be 920m.

Effective range, as per Wikipedia: 200m

"The RPG-7 antitank rocket is designed for close in defense. Although the system will loft the rocket more than 900m, probabilities of hitting a tank sized target are slight beyond 300 meters and are negligible around 500m"
From http://www.scribd.com/doc/33418096/TRADOC-Bulletin-1-Range-and-Lethality-of-U-S-and-Soviet-Antiarmor-Weapons, page 12

From the same document:
RPG-7 hit probability moving target:
Range (m) Percent
50 100
100 96
200 51
300 22
400 09
500 04

There are further tables below that, that describe the first round hit probabilities and first round kill probabilities. I'll leave it to you to examine the document further.

The attached image is taken from this: http://www.scribd.com/doc/24023806/RPG-7-Antitank-Grenade-Launcher document, which, is as authoritative a source as any. Sure, its a bit old, but then, mostly the warheads have changed.

Oh, and then theres this: http://world.guns.ru/grenade/rus/rpg-7-e.html

Also, just out of interest, what were the sources of data that were use in the first place, to determine the hit accuracy of the RPG in the game or as modified by ACE? I think knowing this, would help too.

Updated by Franklin almost 4 years ago

I know if i take up any kind of helicopter on an MSO mission, I eat RPGs all day. Just yesterday i ate an RPG while driving a humvee, watched it come in from roughly 600m out and nailed the drivers window perfectly. This happens way too often too...

Updated by q1184 almost 4 years ago

q1184 wrote:

A repro mission would help.

Updated by total22 almost 4 years ago

Repro mission is very easy to make.
Place a squad of 10 RPG gunners on a runway, and place M1A1 on the other end having around 600m distance in between.
See those RPG gunners fire their RPGs at the M1A1 and count the probability of hitting the target.
You will find that it's around 80% probability that they will hit their target with a pinpoint accuracy.

Updated by Sickboy almost 4 years ago

Please attach one anyway, it's not about how easy it is to make, it's about reducing variable differences.

Updated by rocko almost 4 years ago

  • Status changed from Feedback to Expired
  • Assignee deleted (q1184)
  • Target version deleted (Planned (Needs Contributors))

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